Track etiquette

I have rolled this around in my mind for about a year now, and I have finally decided to put some of my thoughts down here on the forum. I decided that now would be a great time to discuss this because there are no points series running at the moment. Plus I've overheard a lot of this from most of you all at the track, and those who have come to know me know that I do not avoid problems. I am only bringing these ideas up in a effort to support the safety and well being of a sport we all love.

The concept is Track Etiquette, some understand it , yet many don't have a clue. In this post you're welcome to add your thoughts or shoot down any of mine.

I love to race my RC cars; which I'm positive all of you do. It is also a stress reliever for me to work on my cars; which I'm also sure it's a stress reducer for most of us. From this point I will use the editorial "WE" in a concerted effort to speak while including everyone. We love it even more when there's a lot of competitors. Here is where the problems begin. Now we can't expect to have a "Racing Utopia" and part of racing is the bumping and grinding, etc yet there is a point where friendly racing becomes interruptive, upsetting, and downright inconsiderate.

At the current local level, most races consist of bashers mixed in with the passive racers that race for pleasure, and the all out hard core racers. We all have an absolute equal right to race. Here is where the problems begin though. We have people who've never raced; mixed in with people who've raced all their lives. If we're unfamiliar with the racing culture; how are we supposed to know what's allowed and not? Therefore, The goal of this post is to set an overall safe racing culture where all people can enjoy the racing atmosphere.

We all need to be vigilant and try to be very aware of what we are doing at all times when we're at the track. Not only is this important for a positive setting, but there are kids around at all times. We know language is a problem, and difficult to keep under control at times. But it's important to refrain from name calling and random cursing because you never know who's listening or who looks up to us. We all try very hard when turn marshaling and we've all fallen victim to bad turn marshaling as well as not marshaling as we should. I know I've done it; additionally no one can be perfect 100% of the time. So lets be kind to each other. After all; we do this mostly for the enjoyment. On the other hand, there are some of us who don't think that we need to Marshal. We sit down and act like it's a problem to run over and flip a car back over. Please stay focused while marshaling, after all; others tried very hard to turn you over when you were flipped over. Don't use your cell phones, ipods, etc while out on the track - most important----YOUR SAFETY IS ON THE LINE. Many of these cars weigh 7-8 pounds and travel well over 50MPH at times. It doesn't matter how good of a driver we are, off road racing is severely unpredictable - that's why we love it so much, yet imagine taking a hit to the head?! So remain coherent at all times; you'll stay safe and drivers stay happy!

Next, while we're racing and having fun please be aware (as best you can) of what position you're in. Allow leaders to pass!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We all are super goober to the 10th power competitive and love a good battle, but there are places for these battles. Some people who are lapped are trying to battle the leaders, even though they're in last place. I don't know what purpose this serves. Maybe it's just an overwhelming urge to compete with whoever is near no matter what their position is, but this is an incorrect concept and can land you in someones DISLIKE category pretty quickly. It is upsetting when we've upgraded our vehicles with expensive parts and put countless hours into prepping, all while running a in a 1st, 2nd position only to be taken out by an overzealous racer. It's just good practice to allow a faster person go by quietly. I have even seen some people in second place allow the faster third place person go by nicely because the second place driver is slower and knows it. People like Jeff Dayton and Will Bennett are prime examples of people who have great race culture when driving. Jeff and Will, along with many others, would make a great source to reference if you're confused on what we should or should not do concerning driving etiquette. Just ask around. Watch other drivers and their habits, and learn from them. On the flip side, not all mishaps are done via aggression or ignorance. We've all followed someone lap after lap; suddenly we see a quick opening and we try and stick our cars in tight to hug a turn underneath the person in front. This is a legal pass. If during this pass you spin the other person out then you SHOULD stop an wait for them. It IS the right thing to do. This is the hardest point to drive home, because people form opinions over what a correct pass is and what an incorrect pass is. Just play it safe and wait for the other person to get back on track. After all, you don't want to get the reputation of a hacker or a cheat.

If you get turned around, don't drive backwards on the track, as this can result in damage and you can cause others to run into you. The best thing to do is to sit perfectly still until everyone clears. Even better is the possibility that a marshal will save you. Trust your marshals!

Lastly DO NOT corner cut or jump pipes! We know who you people are. This is just plain unsportsmanlike conduct. All drivers must pass and race on the racing surface. If you do cut a pipe get back over to where you should be. Don't wait on the other side until the people in front go by then get behind them.

The purpose of this post again is to help to make everyone's racing experience as positive as possible, and to educate newcomers. I know there is much more that I could add to this list. In an effort not to make the list too terribly long, I decided on these issues as I've seen these issues over and over again. Please feel free to insert your pennies worth on this topic.

I think it's very difficult at times to know what position you are on the race track, a good race director/announcer will constantly remind people of their positions as well as politely remind slower cars that leaders are approaching so they can give them enough room to safely get by. Battling with leaders makes everyone's lap times slower, just let them by clean, then try and follow their lines. That will make you faster.

I personally think slower/more cars makes racing more fun because you actually have to drive well to get by them clean. It makes you a better driver in the long run.

I also think people battle with the leaders because they are trying to prove to themselves that they are just as fast as the leaders are, but one fast lap isn't the equivalent to a full race of consistent fast laps. Patience in any form of racing is a must to be successfull.

I like this post and hope more people contribute.

great posts guys like where this is going i know i am guilty of the language just another reason to remind myself to try to refrainfrom doing it

Jason, We're ALL guilty of yelling at the marshals from the stand. I'm even guilty of a bad word or two every now and then. Personally I haven't heard you say or seen you do anything inappropriate, but like you said; we need to try and monitor ourselves.

Bobby - I also agree with you. The more the merrier makes for the best racing. I was actually going to post more in my original post, but I didn't want to become too long winded. You're also right concerning the announcers. They should be very proactive and let racers know as much as possible. They do hold more control over racing than their given credit for. Eric and Robin do such a great job, but I believe we all can work at improving our skills whether it be driving or announcing.

The only idea I may slightly disagree with is the one on knowing your position. I believe it comes down to each individual. Some people have really clear concepts over what position they're in, yet others don't, and I get that. But people should have guesstimation of their position at minimum. I don't think lapped racers race the front runners because lapped drivers actually think they're racing for the lead. I do, however, agree with the statement you made on how drivers are just trying to prove that the leaders can't pass them. I've been confused at times over what exact position I'm in, but I definitely have a good Idea of where what my position is. The people I'm mostly referring to are the ones who leave the track and come back 3 minutes later, and they are racing like they're going to win; lololol. They will do everything to keep you behind them. Additionally, I agree that passing lapped traffic does make you a better driver. Patience is a virtue even though it's a cliche that's been worn out over time, but the smartest drivers usually win, not the fastest.

Anyhow, hope to see more opinions posted here. See you at the track Bobby and Jason.

hehehe, man, its everywhere lol, now that i've been racing overhere in Guadalajara for over 6 months, i can personally tell you that this happens everywhere. The last position drivers will not let you pass cleanly. You do have to battle them, but yes, at the same time, just like bobby said, battleling with them will actually make you better because you need to adjust and fine tune your touch on the wheel in order for you to pass them cleanly on the inside or outside of the turn. And well, some people do like to battle the top positions because they dont want to be lapped, and some people just dont learn, they will just keep doing the same even if everyone is telling him to let the leaders pass. And i mean, right away you learn and see who is doing the same all the time hehehe.

I think that some people wont change, even if you paid them lol. I think that even if we all change our way of driving and had some more etiquette on driving, there will always be someone that will not roll with flow.

As far as our end, we should just keep teaching and keep reminding them people to be courteous and try to drive as clean as possible, that way instead of 3 or 4 people driving dirty, we will have to deal with only 1 or 2 hehe

Hope everyone is doing fine overthere and just reminding you that pretty soon ill be taking a trip to Hell Paso for a big race

Take it easy my friends

I'm sorry to have offended you professional racers . By allowing kids of all ages to try and enjoy the HOBBY of radio control. Maybe you should race your cars by yourselves in an empty track so you don't have to deal with us rookies trying to enjoy ourselves. Maybe I'm ignorant about the unspoken rules of racing. PLEASE! we all spend good money on our toys. If this continues to be a problem for the educated racer, please tell us when we can go and have fun so we are not in your way. By ourselves.
as for allowing the leaders to pass, I have a better idea, once you earn the lead pull out of the race and consider yourself the winner. That way we don't get in your way.

Maybe separate the pros to race a different day.
This makes me sick to my stomach

i just re-read the complete threat, and i havent found anything that could of offended someone, i just read good comments and good advice as to what some beginning drivers could learn and practice on the track. I mean, i dont think that letting the leaders pass is such a pain to do, you can just let the leaders pass and keep racing at your own pace without blocking or interfering with anyone.

No one is an expert on this hobby, but of course there are racers that are better than others, and on this hobby, and just about in life, remember that it is good to hear advice from someone else in order to make yourself better, whether it be on racing or in just about in every aspect of life.

And please, dont take this personally, this is a forum of local racers and we all just want to help each other, not hurt ourselfs

Gino this is a great topic and I think this is a great place for open discussion. Jsoto- man I remember when I first started racing again at bobby's I was far from a competitive racer. I had my fair share of taking leaders out and trying to race the faster guys. I just didn't know any better. Actually I would bump from the C to the B to the A main and usually finish 7th or 8th. With time I began to get to know racers and their driving styles. We all start somewhere. Ultimately "driver's education" falls on the race director and track culture. I have to say countless drivers meetings at bobby's truly helped me become aware of a lot of things and made me an all around better racer in every aspect. I learned things like "slower is faster" and "car on it's wheels has the right of way" among other items. I don't think anybody intended to discourage up and coming racers from coming out to the track. Or separate drivers in to groups or categories. Nice post Gino and Allllexxxx! Que paso Senor short bus?

I think Wes did a good job on announcing the last race we were at hals. Believe it was 2wd sc. Wes would call out the leader and make the lappers in front aware that the top 3 were coming up on them. Most of the guys will pull out of the way. The thing that makes me kinda pissed is getting some people to marshall after there race. My family and I usually marshal as often as possible even if I didnt race the prev. race. But having to wait on the stand for the race director to have to call people out is aggravating. Lappers dont annoy me to much if they t bone me then ill say something.

Jcsoto1 - It's very difficult on these forums to not offend someone. Let me be the first to apologize if it seems that I have offended you. Offending someone was not at all on my radar when I wrote this. I love kids and have two of my own which will be racing as soon as they can hold a remote and grasp the concept of racing. We are ALL still learning out there. I wish to also state that I don't know any racers who wish for beginners to stay off the track, actually it's the antithesis of this; we want more races.

I remember being soooo nervous the first few times I raced. 90% of that nervousness was attributed to literally being uneducated on what to do when racing. I didn't want to look stupid, make any mistakes that would make me stand out, or cause anyone damage. My purpose was only to HELP newcomers get aquainted with the racing scene so that everyone has as much fun as possible.

Jcsoto1 - I used to drag race heavily in this city, and I remember when forums first appeared. We would get on and post and somehow sometimes some posts were completely misinterpreted. I would get a nasty message stating how ignorant I was, etc. So these forums are nothing new to me. I'm not here in person to defend my points if someone has mistaken them for ugliness. I will be the first one to tell you that I am nowhere near a professional racer. I race for the very same reasons you do. To have fun, be competitive, and enjoy people. I'm not sure if I know you personally, but if you know me you'd know that you're mistaken. I am always willing to help people at the track. I am always supportive of ALL the children and newbees. Heck, our team even cooks hot dogs for everyone to enjoy in an effort to try and expand RC in El Paso. So, I am sorry again if you feel that I've been offensive in any way, but I'd like you to reconsider. Once again the purpose here is to be proactive about situations that are easily manageable, and this was a topic that I knew would spark interest. Thanks for your post, and hope to see you out more often.

Whatup Alex!!! How are you bother??

jcsoto1 wrote:

I'm sorry to have offended you professional racers . By allowing kids of all ages to try and enjoy the HOBBY of radio control. Maybe you should race your cars by yourselves in an empty track so you don't have to deal with us rookies trying to enjoy ourselves. Maybe I'm ignorant about the unspoken rules of racing. PLEASE! we all spend good money on our toys. If this continues to be a problem for the educated racer, please tell us when we can go and have fun so we are not in your way. By ourselves.
as for allowing the leaders to pass, I have a better idea, once you earn the lead pull out of the race and consider yourself the winner. That way we don't get in your way.

Maybe separate the pros to race a different day.
This makes me sick to my stomach

ginoford wrote:

Jcsoto1 - It's very difficult on these forums to not offend someone. Let me be the first to apologize if it seems that I have offended you. Offending someone was not at all on my radar when I wrote this. I love kids and have two of my own which will be racing as soon as they can hold a remote and grasp the concept of racing. We are ALL still learning out there. I wish to also state that I don't know any racers who wish for beginners to stay off the track, actually it's the antithesis of this; we want more races.

I remember being soooo nervous the first few times I raced. 90% of that nervousness was attributed to literally being uneducated on what to do when racing. I didn't want to look stupid, make any mistakes that would make me stand out, or cause anyone damage. My purpose was only to HELP newcomers get aquainted with the racing scene so that everyone has as much fun as possible.

Jcsoto1 - I used to drag race heavily in this city, and I remember when forums first appeared. We would get on and post and somehow sometimes some posts were completely misinterpreted. I would get a nasty message stating how ignorant I was, etc. So these forums are nothing new to me. I'm not here in person to defend my points if someone has mistaken them for ugliness. I will be the first one to tell you that I am nowhere near a professional racer. I race for the very same reasons you do. To have fun, be competitive, and enjoy people. I'm not sure if I know you personally, but if you know me you'd know that you're mistaken. I am always willing to help people at the track. I am always supportive of ALL the children and newbees. Heck, our team even cooks hot dogs for everyone to enjoy in an effort to try and expand RC in El Paso. So, I am sorry again if you feel that I've been offensive in any way, but I'd like you to reconsider. Once again the purpose here is to be proactive about situations that are easily manageable, and this was a topic that I knew would spark interest. Thanks for your post, and hope to see you out more often.

Hi everyone, (YES DIRECTED TO EVERYONE)
No personal fight or drama, leave that to the girls. hahaha
I came to add some more to this great topic.
Gino is one great racer that will help you a ton when you ask him anything and he is completely right that there is no point in trying to keep the faster guy on your back.
I have done it recently but only at the beginning of the race where I came out in first place after the wreck of the first corner so I tried to keep the second place from passing me but there is no point because on the first mistake, bam!! got passed.
It is not a stop your car on the side as they come at you, you can keep a line, inside or outside but the faster guy will thank you if you take the next turn wider so they go through.
I have also learned on this year of racing, practice is what really gets you good at it even over the most expensive trucks or equipment but the good things ease the way to win.

If you do not like the racing environment the track is always happy to have you any day on business hours but as the track takes work they charge for practice. Not going to lie, I have been there when nobody else is to enjoy the track all for myself and let loose.
The only bad to it is nobody helps when you flip.

I am still learning a lot and take the last place happily or close to last most of the time but as long as my cars come out in one piece I am most happiest on the track. Now for the new points series I will give it my best and try to win something.

Sorry for the long post.
And greetings to everybody, specially to el Alex Ortega!
hope you all do great today.

hey hey hey how are you guys???? hehe, im enjoying myself overhere. Actually, im liking since as you guys may know, because of my legal status over there in the US, i couldnt get out of El Paso to go and race out of town. Overhere i have been going to just about all the big races that have been happening since september of last year(which it has been around 8 races out of town) and because of the job that i have, i will be able to apply for my visa and be able to go and visit you guys next year to go and chill out with you guys, and eat some of gino's hot dogs hope everyone is doing fine, and i Salute all of you all the way from Guadalajara Jalisco Mexico specially to the Raceparty.net crew

You better be taking care of my car Alex...lol

Desert Downs Raceway pro wrote:

You better be taking care of my car Alex...lol

the losi??? hehe, i've taken care of both cars, yours and bobbie's, i have won with both cars several times, and i will keep taking care of them until they give up on me brian wish i could go and race to your track. But one of this days

Great post Gino, in providing and sharing information with all racers attending the El Paso and other tracks. Regardless of being a long time racer or new, it's great to learn good sprotsmanship, how to become a better racer, and marshaling at organized events. I know Gino and so many others, are the best encouragers of welcoming new racers.

I hope this helps a little. I just posted the 2x2 sc 10 race from 3-31-12. it was a very good race and wes was announcing. If you watch the video you will see that when you come up on lapped people some will pull over and some wont but either way its better for you. If they do pull over that is good because it is a clear and clean pass. If they don't then its still ok because that just puts you at a better position trying to get around them without bumping. (please keep in mind that bumping will happen. its a off road race.) Also if you notice how wes is announcing he is telling people there places and times. Also he is telling the lapped racers that the leader is coming up on you.

I must admit that Wes did a great job with announcing.

Jason,

Are you going to race on road this Sat? We should go out to DD and have some fun.

...And you're also right, I do remember Wes telling the lapped traffic to watch out for the leaders. Maybe we can promote this style of announcing at the next races. Just keep in mind, that I agree with 99% of what you all are saying. Lapped traffic is fun, and can also be a scenario for disaster. I can tell you that in the SC races lapped traffic is probably the biggest issue, I don't want to refer to lapped traffic as a problem because that's not what it is; it's an obstacle. And yes racing through traffic does help you to become a better racer. I'll NEVER forget the time Jason B got caught up in a wreck going into the first corner. four of us got a great jump on him, but that lasted about 2 seconds. He tripled those little jumps and went right over everyone to regain the lead. That was not a move that was amateur, it was perfect! I've never seen too many moves like that, but Jason is an awesome driver, yet you learn from experiences. So overall I agree that traffic makes for a better race all in all. No win feels as good as one where you've had to maneuver traffic. So, I hope to see everyone at DD this weekend. I missed the last Hal's race, so I'm itching to race!!!

Gino,
Current plans to race Onroad this Saturday, especially due to having several things to test and in becoming better prepared for future onroad scene on the East Coast late this summer. Offroad is definitely an option and will have the cars ready to go, if we don't run Onroad Sat.

Jason - When does it look like you'll be out of here> I really hate to see you leave. I've learned a ton from you. I've always enjoyed racing with you, as you're such a good competitor. With my music, I've always tried to play with people who were great musicians because the only way to get better is to play with people who are extremely great at what they do. I have thoroughly enjoyed you as a friend and a mentor at the track. You've always been a prime example of an all around great person. I hope we get at least a few more races together; especially when Hal's new track is built.

Gino: same to you and always enjoy racing with you! I think the 12th will be a great possibility for Offroad. Leaving in late June, so I look forward to as many races with everyone that I can attend before departing. I'll truly miss everyone here.

alexortega2003 wrote:

hey hey hey how are you guys???? hehe, im enjoying myself overhere. Actually, im liking since as you guys may know, because of my legal status over there in the US, i couldnt get out of El Paso to go and race out of town. Overhere i have been going to just about all the big races that have been happening since september of last year(which it has been around 8 races out of town) and because of the job that i have, i will be able to apply for my visa and be able to go and visit you guys next year to go and chill out with you guys, and eat some of gino's hot dogs hope everyone is doing fine, and i Salute all of you all the way from Guadalajara Jalisco Mexico specially to the Raceparty.net crew

What's up Alex! Great hearing you are doing well and can't wait for you to come down and race with us again. Remember, you will always have a place to stay with us...either at your old neighborhood (the track) or my house. I'm glad you are still winning with your Kyosho SCR and representing Race Party with class!!! Talk to you soon.

P.S. Henry thinks his SCR will give you a good race now that he's seen the light and runs only the best!!!

Alex,
Glad you are doing well and enjoying racing in Mexico..ge'em heck there! The El Paso 2 and 4WD SCT classes are huge and has some tough competition with everyone running one! Wish you the best!